284 - Part 2

Part 2 of 4 Parts

The Following Message Has Been Transcribed For
Clarity, Continuity Of Thought, And Punctuation By
 The LEM Transcribing & Editing Team.


Well, we will just do a brief review. We see the Lord through the prophet, Zechariah, declaring unto all those who have ears to hear that the -- that he will have no more pity. He says he will have no more pity. Now to the carnal mind or with the King James translation, this sounds like the Lord has completely rejected his people, but this is not the case. The way I express this on some of my teachings is he is removing the gentle judgment of the Holy Spirit, the gentle judgment, that judgment which gives you the opportunity to repent, that judgment by which either the Lord himself convicts you, or he sends a man to convict you. And if you repent at the moment, you go on. You are forgiven right then and there, and you go on. This is the pity of the Lord.

But we see another kind of judgment available. Some call it wormwood judgment, and we see this judgment poured out upon Israel -- I am sorry, excuse me, upon Judah, when the Lord pronounced 70 years in Babylon upon them. And even though they cried and they wailed, there was no place found for repentance, although there was repentance, but it did not change the judgment. Seventy years were pronounced upon Judah, whether there was one man in Judah who repented, whether the king repented, whether the priest repented, the judgment was pronounced whether repentance came forth or not. And if you follow through in the Scripture, you see that the whole generation that went into judgment in Babylon, when the Lord overthrew Judah, was wiped out. It was a new generation that came out of Babylon to rebuild the wall of Jerusalem.

So we see -- in Zechariah, Chapter 11, we see him pronouncing the end of the pity of the Lord, that gentle correction of the Holy Spirit. And he says now my judgment will fall, and the only ones that are going to hear my voice are those who are the poor of the flock, so the Lord is saying every time you read about judgment in the Scripture, even if it sounds in the King James like every man will be wiped out, we are to know that God always has a faithful remnant. There is always a faithful remnant, and we see that faithful remnant called the poor of the flock in Verse 11.

“And it was broken in that day,” the covenant called beauty, the covenant called grace, which gives a person an opportunity to repent and make a change right here without any set time of being under judgment. The Lord broke the covenant of grace. The hour is coming where we must grow up, brethren. The Lord has given us his Holy Spirit. Christ is being formed in many members of the church, and the hour is coming where he is saying I have given you this gift as long as I will give it to you. Now whoever will serve me, let him serve me, and whoever [AUDIO CUTS OUT] [?on?] the Lord or that served the Lord or that feared the Lord or that could hear from the Lord, they knew that it was the word of the Lord. They knew it was not Satan trying to misdirect them. They knew it was not deceit. They knew the Lord had broken that covenant.

And also this word -- Hebrew word translated “waited,” it also means to work with nails. Those who are nailing their carnal mind down, they were the ones who heard the Lord, the implication being we shall never hear him with our carnal minds. Our carnal minds will never hear the word of the Lord. Our carnal mind will always oppose the word of the Lord, will always tell us the opposite, will always try to get us to do the exact opposite of what the Lord would have us to do. And the only way we can hear from the Lord is to nail down our carnal mind, and the nail is one of the titles of Christ. He is the corner; he is the nail; he is also the needle. He ha- -- he is the rock. He has many titles, so, brethren, we should know that if we desire to hear the word of the Lord, we must ask the Lord to help us. Help Christ in us nail down our carnal mind because that carnal mind will speak, and he will deceive us, and he will misguide us, and the carnal mind is sin. If we obey him as opposed to the Lord, this is sin unto us. No matter how simple the misstep appears to be, obedience to the carnal mind is obedience to sin, and it is sin unto us. As soon as its recognized, it must be confessed and repented of, and we must go back to the place of the misstep while the Lord allows us.

We are told with Esau, although he was sin great distress over the loss of his birthright, no repentance was found for him. This does not mean that there was no repentance in the heart of Esau; it meant there was -- the Lord would not change the decision. And what -- why would the Lord be so hard-hearted? Because the plan of God must go on, and the plan of God is for the salvation of all humanity. The Lord will not wait for a rebellious, stiff-necked, hard-hearted people. He makes provision for us in our immaturity, but when he makes this judgment that it is time for us to make a mature decision and we fail to do it because of sin and rebellion in our own heart, he will leave us behind for the good of the whole. That is the Lord’s decision.

Verse 12, “And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver.”

This is a very famous verse. S- -- let me try and find my notes on this, please. Well, it is not exactly like you have heard it preached in the church. I guess, that does not surprise you, OK. Oh, I am in the wrong verse. This is Verse 12, OK. The King James says, if this is -- hmm. “If ye think good, give me my price.” Am I in the right verse? OK.

“If ye think this is good” -- in the interlinear, it says, “If this be good in your eyes.” The phrase, “in your eyes,” is not translated. What the Lord is saying to the faithful, the ones who have nailed down their carnal mind so that they could hear the word of the Lord, he says, is this fair to you? Now why would the Lord be asking man, human beings, if what he is doing is fair? Because he wants to see if their response is coming from Christ or from the carnal mind. He says, does this seem right to you that I say those who have the Holy Spirit, let it die; those who have Christ, let it be covered over? I remind you, brethren, that we are told we are to judge angels. We are to judge righteous judgment. We m- -- who have Christ must judge righteousness. So the Lord says to his people, does this sound right to you? And I declare to you that, if it does not sound right to you, if it does not sound fair to you, you are thinking with your carnal mind.

And this is what the Lord is saying: Does this sound right to you that your carnal mind should die, that I should be glorified in you? If it sounds right to you, pay me my price. The Lord is saying to them, I want to you crucify your carnal mind. He is saying to them, and I will show it to you in the Hebrew in just a minute, my life is in you. The life, the breath of life, that I breathed into the creation at the beginning of time, which is now known as the spirit which is in man, she has been captured by Satan and the carnal mind. I want her back. She is my wife. I want her back. I want to join with her. I want Christ formed in the man in whom I am joining with her. I want Christ to be the mind ruling in this creation. If you think this is right, give her up because the only way you can release to me that which is mine is by crucifying your own carnal mind, that your human spirit might be released unto me, her true husband, that Christ might be formed in you permanently, that Christ might rule over your vessel and eventually over the church and all of humanity.

And the Lord is saying to them, if you do not think this is right, then keep your carnal mind and die. He teaches you; he teaches you; he teaches you. He pours out his grace; he pours out his grace; he pours out his grace. If you cannot see the righteousness in his demanding that which is his own, then do not give it up, and serve Satan and die. That is what he is saying, that the faithful of the flock will judge their own souls, confess their sins and kill their carnal minds with the power of Christ and give over to the Lord that which is his own, even the spirit that he breathed into the creation at the beginning of time.

So let me just give a few of the Alternate Translations of these words so you can see it. “If ye think this is good in your eyes” -- remember, “in your eyes” is not translated, but it is in the Hebrew -- “give me my price,” and “the price” is a Hebrew word which means -- it can be “price for anything hired.” It also can be translated “reward.” And you may be aware that this word, “reward,” is used to speak about spirit throughout the Scripture. We are the reward that -- I am sorry. Christ is the reward that we are receiving, and the spirit in us is the reward that he is receiving; we are receiving each other. And I suggest to you that this word, “reward,” means “that which is of God.” He wants the -- and I will show it to you further in a minute. He wants his spirit back.

“Give me my price; if not, forbear.” This word -- “give me my price.” The Hebrew word translit- -- translated “give” can -- means “to be given by providence.” That is another witness that what the Lord wants is the spirit which he breathed in at the beginning of time. Give up to me that which was given to you by providence, that which you did not obtain for yourself, the spirit that I breathed in at the beginning of time. I want her back. That is what he is saying. “If not, forbear.” Hmm. I am in the wrong place. I am sorry. Verse 12. OK.

This particular verse is a very poor translation, so I am going to try and give it to you. The phrase, “and if,” can be translated “even though.” And the word, “not,” is a Hebrew word -- the translation of a Hebrew word, Strong's 3808. We have worked with that a lot. It means “nothing.” It is translated several times throughout the Old Testament as “the wind,” which is typifying Satan’s spirit. It means emptiness; it means nothing, and it is what God considers Satan to be, an empty wind, a nothing. We have done a lot of work with that, excuse me, in the prophet, Isaiah. And I know that this is ver- -- this is a difficult translation, and you will either have to take my word for it or read -- listen to several of our messages where I prove it. And I know I have one message where I gave at least three or four scriptural examples where this word translated “not” is translated -- is used to describe Satan.

So we find one of the tools that we have in translating the prophets is usage. It is usage. I can sit here and tell you all of these things for 20 days in a row, but if I could show you five places in the Scripture where the King James translators have translated it that way, that gives power to my words. And if you want those messages, I could show you where they are. I could find them for you at another time where I did this. I worked on this word translated “not,” and I had several other Scriptures where the King James translators themselves translated it “Satan.” God calls Satan nothing, mocking him, and that is what this word means. So we see that this is a poor translation. He is saying -- I am having some trouble getting this out.

Let me just read you the Alternate Translation. “If you think it is the right thing to do, then loose my spirit or loose my wife who is given to you by providence or by God, even though” -- instead of “and,” “if,” we are saying “even though.” Even though what? It is not there, but I suggest to you, “even though she is joined to Satan.”

And we found out, as we translate prophecy, the d- -- the more hidden the message, the fewer the words the Lord uses to express it, and it is a mystery. If you do not have the true meaning in your heart, you will never get the message of the parable. You will never unlock the parable if you do not first know the truth. This is one of those instances; there are words missing.

“If you think it is the right thing to do, give me my spirit back or give me my wife back, that which is given to you by providence,” the only thing being spirit, “even though,” I suggest to you, “she is joined to Satan.” You see, the Hebrew says give me back my wife even though. Even though what? Even though she is joined to Satan and the carnal mind, give me my wife back.

“So they crucified their carnal mind.” And this word means “to f-” -- that -- this word translated “forbear” -- I am really sorry. I am doing a bad job on this. Let me just try and find my notes again. Where is that word, forbear? [INAUDIBLE] Here it is, OK. This Hebrew word translated “forbear,” it means “loose.” Cease from labor; give it up. So that is -- “forbear” is the word that is translated “loose my wife” or “give my wife back to me,” “forbear.” And it says, “So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver.” This Hebrew word translated “weighed,” it can be translated “to suspend as on a cross,” “to suspend.” The weighed the 30 pieces of silver. They suspended as on a cross, and I suggest to you that that which they suspended on a cross or that which they crucified was their own carnal mind. So the Lord is saying to them, if you think that the spirit belongs to me, if you think I have a right to ask for that which is mine, then crucify your carnal minds and stop resisting me and stop denying me, and the faithful crucified their carnal mind. So they weighed unto him. They suspended on a cross 30 pieces of silver.

Now I spoke to you about the third part yesterday. The number three signifies Satan, and it is 30, so we see three multiplied by 10. We are getting into Bible numerology here. Ten is the number of the law. This is a very deep interpretation. If you cannot receive it, that is OK with me, but this is what the Lord gave me. Thirty pieces of silver -- actually, the word, piece, is not in the Hebrew. It just says 30. Silver is the precious metal which typifies the soul. Gold is the precious metal which typifies the spirit. Silver is inferior, an inferior spirit, an inferior metal to gold. Gold typifies the Spirit of God, and I suggest to you that the silver, when she is no reprobate -- have you heard of reprobate silver? OK. When she is not reprobate, when she is joined to Christ, typifies the -- that female spirit of man. Reprobate silver is the Spirit of God, OK, which is in the soul. Now the human spirit is a part of the soul, so when the soul is reprobate silver, the soul, including that human spirit, is joined to Satan and the carnal mind, but the pure silver is the soul and the human spirit in [?it?] -- joined to the Spirit of God. That is -- they are two different kinds of silver.

So we see the Lord said, if you think that I have a right to my spirit, that which was given to you by God, then loose her. Suspend yourself on the cross. Crucify yourself, and give over to me the third part of the law, OK. Number 10 is the number for the law, and I suggest to you this whole fallen creation is under the law, so the Scripture is saying the third part of the soul which is under the law, meaning the fallen soul; give it back to me.

Now you say, well, the third part means Satan. Why is the Lord saying give back Satan unto me? Brethren, his wife, the Lord’s wife, is joined to Satan. She is joined to Satan. She is so completely joined to him, as the salt is joined to the seawater, as the dye is joined to the garment, so the only way the Lord is going to get her back is to boil the salt sea, boiled as a sin offering. We found that in some death in Dan- -- in some depth in Daniel 7. We are -- our carnal mind is being boiled as a sin offering, and as the water evaporates off, we find the salt crystals of our spirit released and freed up so that she can be joined to the life of Christ, so that is what the Lord is saying. If you think that I have a right to my spirit, OK -- because this soul has captured God’s spirit. He has captured the breath of life and used her to bring forth his own image and his own fallen creation. The Lord says to the faithful, if you think, if you acknowledge that it is not yours, that the spirit is not yours but it is mine, give it up. Do what needs to be done to release her: Crucify your own soul. Give it up. Stop denying me.

You may recall from yesterday, the reason for the Lord’s anger is that he has produced Christ in his people, but they are refusing to live out of Christ. They are denying giving the Lord what is his. What is his? His is dominion; his is authority; his is power; his is rulership. And all of this is in Christ, and to form Christ in you, you must give up your human spirit, and to give up your human spirit, you must give up your carnal mind. You must give up your own thoughts, your own ways, your own attitudes, your own evaluations, and I declare to you that that which you think is right in your carnal mind is wrong in God’s mind.

The carnal mind looking at Christ thinks Christ is wrong. The carnal mind looking at Christ cannot understand the way Christ thinks. The carnal mind is critical of Christ. The carnal mind is always opposite of Christ. The carnal mind always has another opinion than Christ. The carnal mind is always going in a different direction than Christ. The flesh lusteth against the spirit, and the spirit lusteth against the flesh; they will never agree. Someone walking in the Spirit will never agree with someone walking in the flesh, never. How can two walk together unless they be agreed? You will never have agreement. There will be continuous argument, disagreement and dissension so long as at least one person is in the flesh. The only peace, the only agreement, is when everybody concerned is in the Spirit of Christ because even if everybody is in the carnal mind, you will have fighting because the carnal mind fights among it- -- amongst itself. The only peace is everybody crucifying their carnal mind and letting Christ rule because he will rule, and he will have his way. And if he lets you walk away, a most unhappy man are you, if he lets you go.

So this mysterious verse, “So they weighed for me -- for my price thirty silver.” The “pieces” is not in the Hebrew, 30, three, the third part, 10, the law, the third of the law. Give me the third part of the law. Give over your carnal mind to me, that I might crush it and boil it and get my spirit out, “silver” meaning the precious metal which is inferior to the gold, the spirit which is in the soul.

So we see fallen humanity a full expression of Satan in this hour, the one who has stolen the creation from the Father, living his own existence through the creation and refusing to give it up at any cost, rebellion against God, opposing God unto the death because this one is not subject to the law of God, neither can he [?be?] [AUDIO CUTS OUT] in his very nature, in his state of being, he is contrary to everything that God is. God goes up; he comes down. God goes down; he comes up. Brethren, that is why authority is so important in God’s church. If someone is truly a God-appointed authority, frequently, God speaks to that person. And if you are under that authority and God has not spoken to you but you think that your opinion is strong enough to oppose the opinion of the one that God has raised up, it can produce conflict. Therefore, if you are not in an appointed -- a God-appointed position of authority, you should not press the issue, but pray.

You see, there is a place for you. There is no passivity in God’s church. We are all soldiers. Our problem is some of us do not know what our place is. We d- -- want to do something, but we do not know what to do. What you do is pray that the God-appointed authority should hear from God. That is what you do. You pray against deceit. You pray that he is not deceived. Pray for God to deliver that person from Satan, that they should hear only the truth. But to draw up your own device, your own imagination, and press against the one who God has appointed to do something other than they think to do, this is the wrong thing to do, brethren, and it does not glorify God.

So let us see this Alternate Translation for Verse 12, if I can find it. [INAUDIBLE] Verse 12 [INAUDIBLE] Page 6. “If you think it is the right thing to do, then loose my spirit or my wife who was given to you by God, even though she is joined to Satan. So the faithful of the flock crucified their carnal minds so as to return to the Lord that which was his.” Praise the Lord.

Going on with Verse 13, “And the Lord said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the Lord.”

Now I had been preaching that the Lord is the potter for as long as I can remember, and those of us that study with me a lot know almost everything the church has taught is not true, so I find that the potter in this context, in any event, is not speaking about the Lord, and I will show you how I draw that conclusion.

We are on Verse 13. “Cast it to the potter.” The word, “cast it,” means “throw it,” and one of the translations -- one of the legitimate translations of the word, “potter,” is “a maker of statues.” And when I looked at all of the words in the Hebrew and all of the potential translations, I came to the conclusion that this verse is speaking about -- excuse me, about Satan, and the statue that he is making is the carnal mind. You see, the mind is image of the spirit which is God of the creation. When I put the whole thing together, I will show it to you. I had to draw the conclusion that the potter, in this verse, is Satan. I will show it to you.

“Cast it unto the potter.” Throw it to the maker of statues, “a goodly price that I was prised at of them.” This Hebrew word translated “goodly,” it means “a garment.” It means “a wide cloak,” so I do not know why it was translated “goodly.” It is Strong's #145. “A goodly price,” and this word, “price,” Strong's 3366, can be translated “honor” or “dignity.” How you get honor or dignity from the ser- -- same word as price, I do not know, but we have also found in the Hebrew usage that these words, honor and dignity and glory, they are referring to spirit, so we are going to translate it that way.

What about the rest of the words? And the Lord said to me, cast it unto the idolmaker: a garment of honor “that I was prised at of them.” OK. Here is the rest. These words, “at which,” we are translating it “because.” And “I was prised at” can be translated “highly esteemed,” and what the Lord is saying, in the people who have highly esteemed me, in the minds in which I have been highly esteemed, overthrow the idol.

You know, the true idol is your carnal mind. I do not know if you ever heard that. I have it on a lot of messages. The true idol is the idol that is carved in your heart, and either that idol is the carnal mind, or you have the image of the cherubim in your heart. The cherubim is Christ, and the idol is the carnal mind. So the Lord is saying -- and, by the way, let me point out to you that he is speaking to Zechariah, but -- it sounds like he is speaking to Zechariah, but he is speaking to the Lord Jesus Christ. It is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking through the prophet in the first person. And the Lord is saying to a preincarnate Christ, in the minds of the men in whom I am highly esteemed, overthrow their carnal mind. Because we can only crucify our carnal minds to a certain point, and then Christ must come in and utterly defeat him for us.

So those of us who are under the altar that we see in the Book of Revelation, excuse me, saying, Lord, how much longer, how much longer, how much longer? In this verse, the Lord is saying to the Lord Jesus -- the Father is saying to the Lord Jesus Christ, in the people that have been nailing their carnal minds, the people that have highly esteemed me, go in and help them, and overthrow that enemy of their soul who makes them sinners and who causes them to die. So this verse that says weigh me my price, this is what the Lord is talking about.

Overturn the dignity or the spirit of the idolmakers. Overturn the spirit of the idolmaker’s garment. Remember, “goodly” means “garment.” “Price” means “honor” or “dignity” or “spirit.” “Potter” means “the maker of the graven image.” Overturn the spirit or the dignity of the idolmaker’s garment. Who is the idolmaker’s garment? No. The idolmaker is Satan. His garment is the carnal mind. Throw over the dignity of the idolmaker’s garment. Overthrow the carnal mind; that is the command, in the place where I was highly esteemed, only in the men where I was highly esteemed.

“And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the Lord.”

The word, “I took,” can be translated “to seize” or “to capture,” and “the thirty pieces of silver” is speaking about the human spirit who is joined to Satan, God’s wife. And “threw it” -- the word -- Hebrew word translated “threw it” means “to overturn.” Overturn that carnal mind. And we have a Scripture in the New Testament which says, “He who endureth to the end shall be saved.” That Greek word translated “endureth” can be translated “overturned.” The one whose soul is overturned shall be saved. The one whose carnal mind is cut off and displaced by Christ, he is the one that is going to be saved, and we see the same expression here in the Old Testament. Those who are highly esteeming me, overthrow their soul or their carnal mind, that they might be saved.

So just bringing this in context, backing up a little, the Lord is saying I am not going to pity you anymore. No more gentle correction anymore. It is grow-up time. Either you crucify your carnal mind, or I have nothing to do with you. If you have the Holy Spirit and it dies because of my lack of forgiveness, so be it. If you have Christ and it dies because it is covered over because I am not forgiving your sins on a regular basis anymore, so be it. There is only one way you are going to survive, and that is to start this labor of crucifying your own carnal mind. What does that mean? You must begin confessing your sins. No more game playing; no more anointing without repentance; no more gifts and calling of God without repentance; no more healing without repentance; no more deliverance without repentance; no more rain without repentance; no more grace without repentance. And this does not mean a general repentance; this means confession and repentance of the operation of sin in our thoughts, in our deeds and in our words.

I cannot tell you how many people I know who have no problem saying I confess the sin of pride, I confess the sin of trying to t- -- control people, witchcraft, not on -- witchcraft on a human level, OK, not on -- the kind of witchcraft you have here in Africa. I confess the sin of mind control; I confess the sin of rebellion. But you come to them and you say those words you just said, that thought you just had, this is the operation of this sin, and the average person will deny it and resist the challenge to confess it and receive deliverance, but this is the word of the Lord to us in this hour. This is the challenge, and if you do not do it, you will lose the Holy Spirit. Christ will be covered over in you.

Only those crucifying their carnal mind, confessing the operation of sin in their most hidden, inner thoughts are going to survive, and that survival will be in a greater existence than they have now. They will ascend into full stature, the gift of God and its end, salvation, true salvation. So I seized the spirit of the idolmaker’s garment, the carnal mind, and overturned her in the members of Jehovah’s household. So we see that, to be truly in the household of God, we have to be obedient to God, living for God and doing what he challenges us to do. Glory to God.

Verse 14, “Then I cut asunder mine other staff, even Bands, that I might break the brotherhood between Judah and Israel.”

That verse always confused me because I thought at the time that this prophet wrote that Judah and Israel had already separated, so it never made any sense to me at all, and this is what I found out the prophet is saying. “Then I cut asunder mine other staff,” or mine other covenant. The word -- the Hebrew word translated “cut asunder” can mean “break in pieces;” it can also mean “to prune it.” And I want to suggest to you that I choose the word, “pruning,” that out of all the people that have partaken of the grace, the covenant of grace, that God is not wiping everybody out, but he is pruning the tree, and those branches which remain are going on to the New Covenant.

Now I tried to touch on this yesterday without much success; let me try again. I believe with all my heart that the Pentecostal Church and the faith church is -- the church today is not under the New Covenant. We are still under the Old Covenant. Why? Because we have sin. The New Covenant is sinlessness. If we had truly entered into the New Covenant with Christ, we would be without sin. The New Covenant is Bands, united, one with God, crucifixion, if you remember the message yesterday. We are not crucified yet. When we die, when our carnal mind dies, we enter into the New Covenant. When the blood of Jesus is the source of our existence, we enter into the New Covenant.

So how could we be under the Old Covenant? The law of ordinances has been disbanded. The law of ordinances which was given by Moses has been disbanded. My answer to that question i- -- m- -- is this, that the Old Covenant is in two forms. In one way it was given to Judah, and in another way, it was given to Israel. Judah was under the law of Moses. Israel -- the Israel which has separated from Judah -- which in this point is the whole world because in this hour the gift of salvation is offered to whosoever will, OK. We are not being given the law of ordinances that was given to Judah, and I did not look up that Scripture today. I should have, but there is one Scripture where Paul says, “One shall be saved by faith, and one shall be saved through faith,” speaking about Judah and about the people that are coming to the Lord in this hour.

Now I know this is a difficult subject. If you do not receive it, that is OK, but this is what the Lord has shown me. The church today is the John the Baptist company, the church, the Pentecost, faith church. It is John the Baptist company. That is why we are having this crisis in the church. As the one who was least in the kingdom of God is appearing in the congregations of the church which is run by the John the Baptist company, the John the Baptist preachers cannot even recognize the fruit of Christ coming up in the congregation, and if they do recognize it, they do not understand it, and they, frequently if not all the time, try to kill it. They try to kill it.  And we see in the parables Jesus saying to the husbandmen, I want my fruit. I put you in the pulpit to bring my fruit forth in you, but the John the Baptist of ministers, invariably, tries to stamp out the fruit of Christ. This is what is happening in this hour.

So if you just understand what I am talking about, that is all that I ask you. Whether or not you believe it, you pray about it, that the Old Covenant is two-pronged. It was offered to Judah in one way, with the law of ordinances given by Moses, and the second or more recent prong in time, chronologically speaking, is the offering of the Old Covenant to the rest of the world, which in this hour is become a spiritual Israel. Why? Because we are told that in C- -- Jesus Christ, the covenant or of -- a relationship with God is available to whosoever will, therefore the whole world has become Israel, whosoever will, and the offering of the relationship with God is in a different form to the Israel of today than it was to the Judah of 5,000 or I think even more years ago, two-pronged Old Covenant, OK.

And we are not moving into the New Covenant, which is for the whole world, both Judah and Israel together, and this we read about, and we will go over those Scriptures in a few minutes. This is what Paul is speaking about when he says all of those who have circumcised their flesh are the Israel of God. That is in Galatians. We will go to it in a minute. The Israel of God are all the human beings who have entered into crucifixion with Christ and are now without sin.

So we see, in Verse 14, “Then I cut asunder my other staff,” and I suggest to you that the cutting asunder is -- it is a breaking in pieces, but even more than that, it is a pruning. And I will tell you why, because this Hebrew word translated “other,” it makes it sound to you like the Lord is speaking about Bands. He says he broke asunder -- in Verse 10 he says, “Then I took my staff, even Beauty, and cut it asunder,” so you, as well as me, for all these years, have drawn the conclusion that when, in Verse 14, “Then I cut asunder my other staff,” excuse me, it is speaking about Bands, but that is not what it is speaking about in the Hebrew.

That Hebrew word translated “other” really means “second,” “my second staff.” You have to watch these subtleties in the Scripture. Second, meaning staff which is inferior to the first. Second is inferior to the first. The Hebrew word translated “one” or “first” is the same Hebrew word translated “chief.” One is chief, so two is the second in command, right. But yet we have already been teaching that the first covenant is inferior to the second covenant, so how could the prophet be saying that the second covenant is inferior to the first covenant? Do you understand what I am saying? You understand what I am saying?


You following me? I suggest to you what w- -- let me remind you, this word, “staff,” the Hebrew word translated “staff,” it is speaking about a branch. It is talking about a group of people through whom spiritual life is being revealed. So since we know that this word cannot be speaking about the New Covenant, which is greater than the Old Covenant, then what is this second branch? What is this secondary branch? I suggest to you it is the carnal mind that is inferior to the covenant of God. It is the covenant of -- with the carnal mind, and it is pruned. He is pruning it. What does that mean? He is cutting away the carnal mind. He is cutting away Satan. And what is left? The spirit. So the Lord says, “Then I cut asunder.” I pruned that secondary or that other or that inferior branch. That is what he is saying.

You see, now the faithful in the prior verse -- let me remind you, in the prior verse, the faithful had crucified their carnal minds. The Lord had given the law -- the Father had given the preincarnate Jesus Christ the instruction to overthrow their soul, and then he says, while I prune them, I got my spirit out. That is what this means. First he offered -- he made the offer. The people did what they had to do. Jesus Christ did what he had to do, and they were pruned. That is a typical scriptural expression. The Lord said, those who would follow me, step out, and the people stepped out. And the Lord said, and let them be delivered, and then the Scripture says, and they were delivered. That is what this is about. If it is right that you should give me my price, then give me my price, and the people crucified their carnal minds. And then the Lord met them and overturned the whole power of the carnal mind, and then they were pruned. The spirit of -- was freed. That is what this is saying. Glory to God.

And even then I cut ano- -- asunder my second staff, and the King James says “even Bands,” but it is a poor translation, “that I might break the brotherhood between Judah and Israel.” So let me show that to you here. OK. This word, “Bands,” it means -- the New Covenant means to be twisted, and that is signifying the weaving together of the mind of Christ with our humanity. That is the sitting down of the king, the joining of Christ to our soul. To break the covenant -- OK, to break the covenant, that I might break the covenant. The Hebrew word translated “break” can also be translated “liberate,” to liberate or to loose the covenant. The word “brotherhood” means be- -- “relationship,” “between Judah and Israel.”

What the Scripture is saying, that the carnal mind was broken. The human spirit was freed so that the Old Covenant could be joined to the New Covenant so that Judah could be joined with the church of this hour and that altogether, whosoever will, everyone that has crucified their carnal mind, both Jew and Greek, are now members of the Israel of God. That is what this is saying, the Israel of God.

Alternate Translation, “And I broke the other branch in pieces so that the imparted anointing could be liberated, which is the relationship between Judah, the grace of the law, and the Israel of God, the church.”

And let us take a look at the witness on that. Galatians 6:11-18 -- well, let us try Romans first, Romans 11:26. I would just like to show you that, and let us start with 25. “For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, whom I shall take away -- when I shall take away their sins.”

So, you see, the New Covenant is in the removal of sin, and that has not happened to us yet, and we see that in Galatians 6:11-18. Galatians 6:11-12. OK, let us go down to 15. “For in Christ Jesus” -- that means whatever man has Christ Jesus being formed in his heart -- “neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. And as many walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.”

And back in Verse 14 it says, “But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.” So those who are crucified to the world within themselves, those whose carnal mind is crucified to Christ, is the Israel of God, and this is what we see Zechariah talking about in Chapter 11.

I have an Alternate Translation on that. “And I overturned their carnal minds so that the imparted anointing could be liberated, which is the binding together of the grace of the Old Covenant, first to Judah and then to Israel, with the grace of the New Covenant, which is the Israel of God.” Praise the Lord.

OK. I think that is all we are going to take on Zechariah tonight. Does anybody have any questions on this? If not, we will just open the floor. You have some questions?

My first question is on this third part. You said -- you explained that the third part means Satan. Then you said 10 means the law. I did not actually get how the third part was of the law. That is Satan now being the third part and then 10 being the law [?was to be given back?].

OK. You are saying that you are not familiar with the number 10 typifying the law?

            Yes. Ten means the law.


            And the third part means Satan.


            Can you explain how that was [?to be?]?

How I got those symbols?


Right. Your having no -- you do not have a problem with the symbols of the number three and the number 10. You wanted to know how I related it to this Scripture, OK. It says -- the King James says 30 pieces of silver. The word, “pieces,” are not in the Hebrew. It just says 30. So I went into my Bible numerology. Three times 10 equals 30, and I said three, third part, 10, meaning the law, so the third part of the f- -- of this creation, which is under the law, OK. Now the third part of the creation which is in Christ, OK, the third part would not be Satan, you see. The third part of the creation which is fallen, which is under the law -- and I did have a witness for that for you in the New Testament --


-- translation. Revelation -- I think it is Chapter 4. We found where it says that this fallen soul is under the law.

Revelation 6:5, “And as the power of Christ released the third part of the firstfruits of the living soul from Satan’s control, I understood that the part of the firstfruits company which was seen in the realm of appearance, even Adam, was saying let the work of the Lord Jesus Christ appear in the firstfruits of the living soul, and let them be aware of it. And I saw in the spirit, and there it was, the part of the firstfruits company which was in darkness” -- that is the part that is under the law. They were in darkness -- “and without the light of God, even the human soul, and he was under the yoke of the law in his part, which is the third part of the firstfruits company.” Did that help you any? OK.

In the [?typing?] of the Scripture, you just said that silver means the soul, and the gold is the Spirit of God. Now if we type that in, how -- could you explain how the selling of Jesus Christ 30 pieces of silver --

[INAUDIBLE] oh, in the New Testament, mm-hmm. Thirty pieces of silver. I really have not -- well, 30 pieces of silver. I really have not thought about that, to tell you the truth. I know that it is tied into Zechariah, but I do not see the correction. Let us see if the Lord will give me anything on that. I should have thought about that while I was preparing this message. What would you say, Father? Thirty pieces of silver. Hmm. Thirty pieces of silver. I do not have anything right now. I will try to have an answer for you tomorrow night. I do not have anything right now.

            [INAUDIBLE] question [INAUDIBLE]




The price was 30, but I think -- I cannot remember. It is somewhere in Matthew, but where it also says that, where Judas was [?remorse?], and he repented. In that same verse, it also stated that 30 was the price for blood.

For blood.

And in the Old Covenant, during atonement or I think redemption, they need 30 pieces of silver to redeem the sons --


-- so 30 was always symbolized, used to redeem, so [?on that maybe you should?] --

OK. You know, it c­- -- it -- there is always -- if one needs to take the interpretation on two levels, that is OK. And I do not have anything. I better stop talking because I do not have anything to tell you right now, but I will pray about it, and I will try to have an answer for you tomorrow night, OK. But I believe that that is what the Lord told me about the -- weigh out 30 pieces of silver, and it is very possible that the King James translators, taking this other knowledge from the Old Testament that 30 pieces was the price for blood, and they translated this deep work of Zechariah accordance with that understanding, OK.

My other question is in connection with sin. We know that, before Jesus died, there was this woman that was caught in adultery. After the whole issue, Jesus said, “Go, and sin no more,” and he has not crucified his own carnal mind. How was that possible? Do you understand my question?

Woman in adultery, how is that possible? OK.


Yes. Well, when -- I looked up every word in the Greek of that account, and I found out, when Jesus -- the Scripture says Jesus stooped down and wrote in the dirt, and all -- people have written books, volumes, on what he wrote in the dirt. But when I looked up every word in the Greek, I found out he was not playing with the f- -- natural dirt on the ground, OK. The Scripture says Jesus stooped down. I believe that, in his walk, in Jesus’ walk, he was always the Son God, but depending on whether he was communing with the Father or speaking to fallen men, he was at various levels of spirituality. We know we read about the Zadok Priesthood, that when they ascend into heaven, they will have one garment on, and when they come down, they will have another garment on.

So when the Scripture says that Jesus bent down, it means his s- -- he caused his soul to go down as low as possible so that the Christ in him came up to its highest position, and in that authority, he wrote on the earth of the woman’s soul, and he changed her nature in that area, whereas she had written on her soul adultery, the sin of adultery, meaning Satan had the power to cause this woman to commit adultery anytime he wanted to; she was overcome in this area. Jesus wrote a new writing on her soul, and he wiped -- he literally wiped that sin out of her soul, so, therefore, he could say to her, go, and sin no more, because I have made it possible to go and sin no more. You see, for the Lord to tell us to go and sin no more when we are incapable of it makes no sense at all. That is why the true forgiveness of sins is only accomplished when the Lord changes our heart.

If the Lor- -- if it is just a verbal forgiveness, if I say I forgive you and you go out tomorrow and you do the same thing, we have a Catholic Church confessional here. You go out and you do it, and you come back; I forgive you. You go out and you do it again, and you come back, and you are still going to die because of sin. When Jesus Christ forgives out sins, he removes the potential for sin from us. The true forgiveness of sins is the impartation of sinlessness. You see, it is a misunderstanding to think that the Lord will accept our continuing on in sinning and continue to forgive us. That is only a temporary condition. The true forgiveness of sins is to rearrange our heart and change the nature of us, that we will no- -- never sin again, and that is the true forgiveness of sins.

See, God will never tolerate sin. He will judge sin, and the judgment for sin is death, so the only way to deliver us is to stop us from sinning, and that is what he is doing through the crucifixion of our soul to Christ. That crucifixion will prevent or destroy all potential for sin, and we shall ascend into sinlessness, which is the reality of the New Covenant, sinlessness. [AUDIO CUTS OUT] [INAUDIBLE] [?entered in?] in w- -- [AUDIO CUTS OUT] until we stop sinning.

We are still under grace, which says you are a sinner, but I receive you anyway. I forgive your sins. The grace which was extended to Judah required the slaying of animals. The grace which is extended to Israel is covered by the spiritual blood of Jesus. It is a -- the grace which is extended to Israel is more mature, if you will, than the grace which is extended to Judah. And we have it much easier than the grace which was extended to Judah because God’s plan is progressing, but the New Covenant is in his blood, flowing through our veins, at which time we shall be without sin. So the only -- there is only one man that has entered into that New Covenant, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ.

What I am trying to say is does that not mean that it was possible during that time, without Jesus Christ dying or Jesus dying, for [?a people?] to go and sin no more?

I see.

I thought Jesus died so that [INAUDIBLE] [?and?] forms the Christ within us to [?rock on?] the carnal mind.

He became the Lord Jesus Christ, but only after he was glorified.



            The woman [CROSSTALK]

How did it happen? Yes.


Well, I believe that that was with regard to the adultery; it was not with regard to her whole sin nature. That is my opinion, you know, because I c- -- based on other Scriptures, I believe Jesus was the first begotten from the dead, and on that basis, I believe that Elijah and Enoch did not ascend into heaven. I think w- -- you asked that question, and I explained it, and I believe that eventually they passed out of this world system, OK, because Jesus of Nazareth was the first man to be raised up out of this realm of death to live a glorified life in the spiritual realm of his Father. So based on that, I have to draw the conclusion about and about Elijah and about this woman, that she was healed from her adulterous nature, but she still died. No. I do not believe that, yeah.

            And I was wondering what [CROSSTALK]





Yes. I believe that. So there are so many Scriptures. It is j- -- also along the same line with Jesus’ disciples saying this man who is ill, what -- did he sin, or did his parents sin? And Jesus said, neither, this man -- or this is for the glory of God. It does not mean that sin did not produce this illness. It means that the Lord is no longer interested in who did it. He is going to heal the man, and he -- that is the Scripture that says all things will work for the good, for those who love the Lord, or the devil meant it for evil. Satan meant it for evil, but God used it for my good. Everything that is evil in our life, God is using for our good.

And I have given you my opinion that I see the most wicked people in the world coming into the kingdom first and coming in with more power than the people who are from three generations of Pharisees who have never really done any serious behavioral sin. And the people who have been engaged in serious behavioral sin are coming in frequently the first generation of people in their family to know Christ, and they are zooming ahead in the kingdom. So he who is last will be first, and he who is first will be last, and it makes no sense to the carnal minds at all who think that they had a measure of righteousness in their good behavior. And the fact that they never engaged in fornication, they never engaged in adultery, they never drank, they never took drugs, they always honored their parents -- and we see this in principle also in the parable of the prodigal son, OK. When the prodigal came back, the son that never sinned was enraged and jealous of the Lord’s tre- -- of the Father’s treatment of the sinful son, and I see it in the church. I see it today, some of the most anointed people coming out of lives of deep sin, and the church frequently very angry and rejecting of them also.

So we see, when we examine the average believer who is entering into this New Covenant by beginning to crucify their carnal mind, we see them typified by David’s band. David being in exile, the Scripture tells us criminals came to join him and to follow him. David’s band was all criminals and outcasts of society, yeah, and that is how I feel that we are. We are outcasts as far as the traditional church is concerned. We are outcasts. We are frequently persecuted. We are frequently very small numbers, and we look very different than the rest of the church, and the only thing that matters is that -- the anointing and that God is with us and that he has called us. I know at least one preacher that has moved along with the Lord from the old order into the new order. He is ha- -- used to have hundreds of people come to his meetings, and I was with him in New Jersey a couple of years ago. When he looked around, so few people, and he said, “This is what God is doing in this hour,” so few people, so if numbers is important to you, you have a real problem, but numbers cannot be important to you; it has to be the work of the Lord.

I also believe that the Lord is calling very strong people to this end-time ministry, people who could bear the persecution from the church, people who will stand even though people come to them and say, well, how could you go there? The -- could the whole church be wrong? Could this little handful be right? So he is calling people who, in the world, were very rebellious people, and they have that rebellion in them, and the Lord is taking hold of that rebellion and using it as a strength to stand against the pressure of the traditional church. And the average person that was brought up without rebellion, that did everything they were told, everything their parents told them, everything their teachers told them, everything the church told them to do, they have a problem rising up when God says rise up and come out and join a small group of outcasts that are doing everything the exact opposite of what the church is doing. They cannot do it, but the man or the woman who was rebellious in the world, he can do it, so that is what I see happening. It is a very rare person that is an in- -- true individualist that can stand by themselves and not be led by the herd. That is what I see today.

Transcribed by Verbal Fusion 05/30/16

1st Edit 05/31/16 rh

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Pastor Vitale's Bio

Sheila R. Vitale is the founding teacher and pastor of Living Epistles Ministries and Christ-Centered Kabbalah. In that capacity, she expounds upon the Torah (Scripture) and teaches Scripture through a unique Judeo-Christian lens.

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